David's Great Grandmother, Anne Matilda Biddle, ran "The New Inn" around , sometimes serving customers as early as 7am; whilst her husband was a shoemaker working from the pub. Eric worked at the pub until he was 91 but sadly passed away in December aged The pub is reputedly haunted. An outbreak of poltergeist activity was reported after building modifications were made to the dining room - bottles, ornaments and plates were smashed by unseen hands.
Several people also reported seeing the ethereal outline of a figure, and locals claimed it to be the wraith of a former landlady murdered by her husband. The real tragedy was they stayed married for 42 years. Ask yourself this - would you be happy if your children ended up in the exact same kind of relationship? If they were unfulfilled and never had organisms? If you truly and honestly want something better for your children, then go ahead and model the behavior of striving for something better. I've been in a situation like this and well its off and on because I'm not good at cheating but I agree with Dan.
Sometimes it feels like you have no other choice the body, mind and soul need different things and if the person you are in love with can't have a healthy sexual relationship and it will break everyone's heart if the relationship dies then why end something over sex. Open relationships don't work for everyone but neither does Monogamy. Yes breaking up after a thirty yr marriage is tough, staying longer in a dysfunctional one is tougher.
Your kids have their own lives and though they might resent you for leaving their mother, and changing their expectations of how their family is, they will get over it.
Thirty Things before Thirty Years
You have been a good husband and father and your job of child rearing is done. Now, go enjoy your life. Don't cheat, LW. Talk to your wife and tell her everything you told Dan. Or just show her this letter you wrote. Then tell her that sex and intimacy are very important for your health and happiness, and ask her to work out a solution with you. If she still insist on very little sex and touching with her, and won't agree to you getting these needs met elsewhere, then you need to work for an amicable divorce.
This way she will have a say in what happens next in your marriage. Yes, divorce will be hard for all of you, but your kids are grown and have their own lives now, it won't be as devastating for them as when they were younger. And it will be much more devastating for your wife if you take away all her choice and agency in your marriage, by deciding to cheat without being honest with her first about your needs. Cheating will kill your marriage eventually, even if you manage to hide it - the guilt, the expense, the lying, the logistics, the ick!
Be honest with your wife and maybe you can figure out a way together that will work for both of you.
MORE IN LIFE
Don't cheat. Lying to the people you love is not a good move - and you probably will get caught. Get a divorce or separate. Your kids are grownups and will be just fine. Your wife will be fine - do you really think that she's so fragile that she'll collapse without you? If you tell her honestly that you want a divorce because you two aren't compatible, you'll probably manage to stay friends. If she catches you in a affair that's much less likely. I think he should see a sex worker. That's the most discreet option if he has his own spending money.
Plus, yes there are some women in this same position. But is he definitely going to find them? Do we really need yet another man in his fifties out there looking for someone discreet to make up for his unsatisfying marriage?
All the "Dtmfas" just because sex isn't happening? There is more to relationships than sex, most people realize once they are out of their teens Keep the good things in this relationship presumably there are some and go out and have affairs. You need to leave this person. Wait a while if you have to, for for the kids, but start making plans now. Also, it doesn't solve the problem of wanting actual connection and romance in his sexual partners.
As a divorced man he can probably find a nice woman his own age that he's emotionally and sexually compatible with, marry or have an open romantic relationship with her, and still be his ex-wife's buddy. The wife, frankly, deserves to be cheated on. We can try to repair our sex life by getting you whatever medical care you might need and seeing a sex-positive couples counselor. Or we can discreetly open the relationship. Or we can amicably separate. I am open to whichever of those we choose, but we have to choose one.
And there may be a way for him to avoid being the bad guy here as far as his children are concerned, by getting out in front of the situation. If he can, he should consider meeting with them privately or along with their respective spouses, who may be more objective and sympathetic and confiding in them. LW sounds like a people-pleaser, and he needs to acknowledge that his happiness has value, then advocate for himself.
However, I'm not sure this conversation with the kids is a good idea. He might be trying to get out in front of her spin on a split, but it's bringing their kids too much into their marriage. Let the kids know when you're separating, naturally, and if the wife tries to make him the bad guy, he can gently explain that she wanted to change the terms of their marriage in a way he couldn't accept. But don't jump the gun on this and drag the kids into the drama of maybe.
Dan forgot two crucial pieces of advice for the LW. If you cheat, get a vasectomy and a supply of condoms. The vasectomy will eliminate paternity dramas and the condoms will reduce your chances of contracting a STI. Also, keep the condoms someplace besides your home or car, so your wife won't find them. This woman has some serious hang ups about sex and frankly, they seem much more related to past abuse and her failure to meaningfully address it than a convenient claim of asexuality.
She should have realized this and sought counseling years ago. As Dan has often said, sex comes standard in marriage. Oral comes standard. This man loves her but she has consistently failed to be a good, or even sufficient spouse. She has betrayed him, not the other way around. She has cheated him out of a fulfilling marriage. Lack of sex is a dealbreaker for him. As it should be. If he wants drama but a possible solution that allows him to stay with her, by making her evaluate the extent of her love for him, then he can offer her a range of choices and see what she picks, and picking the one he wants if she refuses to pick.
- Thirty Years Unplugged by Chris Livingston on Apple Music.
- The Trustworthy Leader: Leveraging the Power of Trust to Transform Your Organization.
- Skid (Skid Young Adult Racing Series Book 1).
- Spark Stories.
- Fibre-Optic Communications (ISTE)?
She may adjust her expectations and idea of what is a dealbreaker when the consequences of a failure to do so are real and imminent. Or, he could make a decision for himself as to the course of action he feels best for him to follow, tell her what it is, and go on with his life, either as a married man with a dadt arrangement, or in an open marriage, or separating or divorcing. I think the third option is the best. I prefer this course because I think it is time he takes agency for his own happiness.
But she has failed him and their marriage and he absolutely needs to frame this situation that way in all necessary communications with her and third parties. He should not allow her to make him the bad guy to himself, to their children, or to anyone else. First off, could we please draw a distinction between someone who is asexual because that's her orientation from the get-go, someone who doesn't want sex because of traumatic experiences, and someone whose interest in sex has fallen off because of getting older, menopause, or perhaps boredom from sex with the same person?
A good therapist could help Discouraged's wife make the distinction. A good therapist might be able to help Discouraged figure out a way to keep her marriage in working order.
The Stranger In My Bed | Michael Fleeman | Macmillan
My question is what Discouraged wants. He wants sex, obviously, but I got the idea that what he really wants is sex with the wife he loves and is committed to. I'm not sure that loveless commitmentless sex with someone else is really what he wants. And that's why I recommend divorce. It means Mrs. Disc gets the sexless life she wants, and it means Discouraged gets to pursue a loving sexual relationship with someone else.
Or, in therapy, put the options to Mrs. Disc and let her figure out what might be best for her there. As it is, she does seem manipulative, but I have sympathy for her nonetheless. As long as one of her choices is not "marriage continues as it has without sex". I'm certain our children would all feel betrayed, as they drew courage from watching us work through our struggles and stick together all these years. I could understand if Dan was trying to give the LW what they wanted I have little respect for what Dan's advice is in service of.
As for your children, would they be willing to take vows of celibacy to see you and your wife stay married? If you think for a second that a partner this controlling and thoughtless is going to quietly turn a blind eye to an affair or make it easy to disentangle yourself from them, you're delusional. The kids are grownups, you've done the stuff you were morally obligated to do once you had them good on ya , now it's time to actually live a life in the years you have remaining to you.
This will just make the divorce proceedings even more slanted towards her favor, and they already will be. Dude, she has been trying to force you to divorce her for years now. Do you really think her intentional harming of you for years is just some accident? At this point she is just seeing how much shit you are willing to eat. Stand up for yourself. Why would you even want to be around this person? Call a lawyer that specializes in divorce and do exactly what they say. Why lie about it?
Why not just tell your wife "I want to have sex with you, but you don't want that so I'm going to have sex with other people" and do so? Maybe it will hurt her I don't know why; if it does maybe you could discuss that and get to the bottom of what the hell is going on with her , but she's been hurting you for decades. The one thing she's done right is to open up to you about what her boundaries are, faking orgasms, and not wanting sex.
She could have lied to you your entire lives about that stuff, and you'd be robbed of the truth of your own sex life. You owe her the same honesty in return. You don't owe her a lifetime of celibacy, but since she's your wife you do owe her honesty and the respect of letting her know what is happening in her own marriage. I also just want to add that I would be absolutely devastated if I found out that one of my parents lived out their life in a sexless marriage out of fear of "devastating" me with a divorce.
I'm always sort of shocked at these letters that say "it would devastate my partner if we got divorced," but what is it doing to YOU, NOW? It's devastating to be rejected constantly, and she's telling you that you now must give up sex for the rest of your life. Do you really want to pay that price? I wouldn't. She's hurting YOU by refusing to be reasonable. Dan has said many times I thought that advice was only for when there are YOUNG children who need caring for or when your partner is ill and depends on you somehow.
OP should just get a divorce. Man, I sure would love to hear her side of this. I bet it sounds very different. I'm sensing very poor skills on his part and an inability to keep trying to get him to understand what she needs. Don't buy it. THat's not something a woman says when she doesn't want to have sex and is trying to put you off. THat's an attempt to fix something and he doesn't know how.
They desperately need some sex therapy together and if the only solution is an open marriage- than I hope he realises it's open for her too. I'm so amazed that our Dan would recommend cheating to this LW in this marriage-with-grown-children, that I find myself wondering why. Hopefully it's not a projection of attachment to one's own marriage. I know it's not a religious thing; hopefully it's not a cultural head-trip.
While I feel strongly that commitments should be kept regardless of whether a friggin legal contract is made , the whole idea of MAKING a lifetime commitment is crazy if that means one is stuck if things change so much and nothing can be done to make it work. And why? Just to save others from things they'll get the fuck over? Just to model dysfunction for his children? Maybe Dan just was busy and without enough thought pressed the "do what it takes to stay married and stay sane" button, which admittedly can be appropriate in other circumstances. To preempt disagreement I don't have time for, what if one's spouse has Alzheimer's or is in a coma and needs one's health coverage and blah blah blah.
I was in a somewhat similar situation. Get divorced and find a partner who actually cares about your happiness. Your children will understand your decision better than you think. I'm surprised to see even ONE person 31 agreed with Dan. I'm not knocking you, Rogerthehat, I'm just highlighting our near-consensus. But honestly, I think everything else in the Universe we'd have more disagreement about.
Cheating is a horrible suggestion. Clearly, this woman has issues. Regardless, the relationship is dysfunctional. Staying in it is the worst thing you can do. A close second to that is cheating as that is dishonest, and while the hallmark of our society, is abusive. Walk away. Leave the relationship. Oh, one more thing.
Right now you are very heavily invested emotionally in a particular vision of your marriage. I suggest that you get a therapist and talk over your choices. I did that and it was a tremendous help. I mean, getting your Dick wet is important. But so is not being heartbroken and lonely and in middle age. No amount of hookers-with-a-heart-of-gold can fuck him into a loving, emotionally safe relationship. I'd value that more than sex; everyone here is like, i dgaf is there a baby in this bathwater! Even though he's not perfect. But since we can't be sure, I mainly think he should be more motivated by hope for better than by fear of losing what's he's already unhappy settling for.
Even if he does lose that gamble, I believe living in hope is better. Dan missed here. No reason to stay. Give her the choice to stay with you, but in an open relationship, which she has one year to grow comfortable with, or you are leaving. You might ask her to get her hormone levels checked too. Good luck. Your wife is either traumatized about sex and has been for 30 years how has she not gotten over it? My money is on the latter. I see two options: Leave your wife, or be upfront about seeking sex elsewhere.
Cheating will not end well for you. It's true that this one is sadder because both are "in love" D agrees to open or companionate or something. If she doesn't, that's on her and he shouldn't be tyrannized by her choice. He also says he feels suffocated in this marriage, which to me is the main truth he shares here. He loves his life with her, except for this one HUGE thing. He doesn't think it's worth blowing up his life to leave.
So why can't he let her make the choice? So you pick. I can go have sex either with a friend or with a sex worker and come home to you, or we can divorce. But I am going to have sex. Because she's made it already by forbidding him from having sex and because she has been setting the tone for the relationship for the entire time it has existed. Why is it so awful that this guy for once in the relationship dictates something about it? That said if he basically told her, "I don't accept your terms, the marriage is over" then that would accomplish the same end as far as I'm concerned.
Relationships are about individuals coming together and working out what they are for themselves. This one basically has had the wife dictate a major aspect of it and that needs to end for his sake. After raising 3 children and taking care of a household and husband for 30 years, it's possible that she's just goddamn tired and sees sex as yet another chore.
Escapee 63 - The letter seems to say that the sex was limited and dysfunctional from the beginning, so no, it didn't start "After raising 3 children and taking care of a household and husband for 30 years". Vivic I have to admit I had the same initial reaction. Like some of his comments don't make sense and get a little confusing where it matters. She identifies as asexual but still enjoys sex on the "rare" occasions they have it how often is that, D?
She has enjoyed sex with vibrators in the second decade, enjoys sex occasionally now, but is completely overwhelmed when he touches her? And wants him to go more slowly, but he can't? A little confusing. Nevertheless, oral comes standard, feeling bad about helping him masturbate is bullshit and if she considers porn to be cheating then it's useless. But If she won't give him an open marriage because she still wants to work together to improve their sex, then that should change the response to him, otherwise, I agree with everybody else.
It seems passive aggressive and manipulative and for sure dishonest. Why does Dan prefer this approach to the one several commentators have suggested, which is to say "It's not fair for you to prevent me from ever having sex. Here are your options Having sex outside his marriage, a one off cheat, could give this man the kick in the arse he needs. His wife is a mind fuck and why does he put up with it.. If you died they would have to survive without you and lying to yourself could bring that on sooner anyway.
Short on time, so haven't read all the comments, but I'm with 3xina who says, " Children are harmed by parents who should not be together more than they are by parents who divorce It's either that or divorce. Make your choice. Maybe you're right, maybe D isn't capable of behaving with honor, and only capable of doing something only arguably better than nothing. If so, go ahead, D. But know that that's pathetic. D, for the love of pete, "Give Mrs. D the choice between open and over" me Yes, D, you'll probably gonna feel fear of change when issuing such an ultimatum.
But as GhostDog said 62 "Relationships are about individuals coming together and working out what they are for themselves. D choose whether to be part of your life going forward. SHE probably can't know what she'd say, only when confronted with the end D might be afraid to give her the choice vs. And whatever that is will be right for everyone in the family. I'm generally with Sportlandia on this one. But I do think counseling could be another step. After that, cheat away. But here is the problem for an older guy: 1 Affairs become much harder. The pool shrinks because most younger women don't want to mess around with a guy who is "dad's age," the looks certainly start to drop off unless the guy is super hot, and older married women start to realize that all of the problems with their husbands are the same with the other dude.
And from my experience sex with prostitutes is just too quick; even no rush is really a bit too rushed. I even question his request to open up the marriage since I think that move is likely much easier for a younger guy who is decent looking. Anyway, none of this provides a specific option. But I would first try therapy but set a realistic date. Every month that passes makes things more difficult. If your sex life doesn't change then look for an partner for an affair. If that leads to a divorce then that's a risk you need to be willing to take. You're not happy now. You are getting hopeless about negotiating with your wife.
You don't want to divorce and try a nice platonic relationship, but you don't want to cheat and be another guy who abused her. All devastation is not created equal. Not many people would choose to be cheated on rather than opening a marriage or divorcing. It is a safe bet that one would choose an open relationship to being cheated on. So I think the relevant information is if the wife would prefer an open relationship to a divorce.
If she would prefer a relationship open only on your side or can't even consider and answer the question when pressed, then there is at least a shoddy case to stay chaste or cheat if she is fragile and you are seriously worried she may have a mental break with any other option.
BUY THE BOOK
There's no way to pretend that cheating on her is anything other than screwing her over to get what you want if she would prefer divorce to opening the marriage.. As far as the negotiation options.. If you pitched an open relationship as having value for her, maybe a young tight body with a different hang and some different moves would respark her desire.. This might sway her more than giving her veto power over your latest eye candy.. She may even prefer dadt rules so that you do not veto or even know about her choices.. Or you could work harder to learn about her sexual response and turn her on by asking her to show you how she likes to be touched and tongued..
Maybe she wanted you to go slow enough to make sure her pussy was on board before expecting her to engage with your dick, so that any move that was not turning her on was too fast unless her pussy was wet.. She doesn't seem to instruct clearly, her complaints are vague and she seems to sit on her unhappiness for years before trying to change things too.. It seems you have been really unfamiliar with your wife's sexual response although her actions have a lot to do with that too..
You would think a counselor could help with clear communication here.. I think you should exhaust all options before giving up by cheating or leaving. Maybe you just need some time to yourself to regroup and plan you sound kinda depressed. You still have sex rarely although she identifies as asexual? Why did she want to identify as asexual instead of going to doctors? Maybe she is cheating. If it should happen just have patience with their sadness that the world wasn't as perfect as they thought, like when they mourned Santa, and don't blame them and don't encourage them to be nosy about your love life and they'll be fine.
And if she is a healthy asexual then she shouldn't want to be monogamous with a sexual person anyway, take it slow, talk about what agreements you can make to live apart happily, she'll be fine. If he leaves his wife, she and the kids will be devastated. This is such a sad truth to have to face.
If he gets caught cheating, his wife and kids will be devastated. He can fuck right off. Ending the marriage need not destroy his relationships with his kids -- or their mother. Getting caught cheating will. Curious 68, sounds to me like the LW has behaved with honour for the last three decades, colluding with and indulging a woman who has done zilch to heal her wounds.
If he has sex with another woman it might break the stranglehold he is suffering under, worrying more about how his grown kids are going to feel if their parents break up than noticing he is being shafted, and not in a good way. LW sounds like a doormat and wife sounds manipulative.